What did Netflix’s “Making a Murderer” leave out?

makingamurdererIf you’re anything like me, you finished watching Netflix’s hot new true crime documentary, Making a Murderer, and immediately scoured the internet for every piece of evidence you could find that was left out in an attempt to form your own opinion of what happened. In this post, I’ll pull together all the evidence I could find and break it down for you so you can determine for yourself what to believe.

kenkratzAfter the documentary was released, Ken Kratz, the prosecutor who led the state’s case against Steven Avery told the media that many pieces of evidence were conveniently left out to sway the viewer into seeing things from the defense’s point of view. In fact, Kratz told Fox6Now.com that 80-90% of the evidence of the physical evidence used to convict Steven Avery was left out of the documentary. Really? 80-90%? Let’s take a look.

What did the documentary leave out?

  •  Steven Avery showed an interest in raping, torturing, and killing women before he was exonerated in 2003. According to Kratz, an inmate who knew him during his 18-year stint in prison for the rape he did not commit in 1985 came forward to say Steven had talked about building a “torture chamber” once he was released so he could rape and kill women. Steven also allegedly told another inmate that burning a body would be a good way to dispose of it.

My opinion? Take this with a grain of salt–why would we believe other criminals making these statements? They could be saying these things in hopes for a lighter sentence, and we have already seen the state’s shoddy interrogation tactics first hand.

  • People Magazine states that Steven Avery had once answered the door wearing just a towel and Teresa Halbach specifically asked her employer not to send her back to his residence.

This seems to be stretching the fact. I could find no evidence Teresa specifically asked not to go back to the Avery residence, but I did find this article from the Chippewa Herald, where Teresa’s coworker, Dawn Pliszka, stated:

“She had stated to me that he had come out in a towel. I just said, ‘Really?’ and then she said, ‘Yeah,’ and laughed and said kinda ‘Ew.’’’

Seems like they are just kind of laughing at him? I don’t think this proves Teresa was scared of Steven Avery at all. I also think it’s important to note that Pliszka’s testimony about this incident was not allowed into the trial.

  • On the day she went missing, Steven requested Teresa specifically, but did not use his real name or phone number when booking the appointment. Kratz stressed that this was important because it showed premeditation and deception–meaning Steven specifically wanted Teresa on his property that day and gave the fake name and number to trick her into showing up.

This piece of evidence appears to be true, as noted here and here. However, I don’t believe you can infer premeditation and deception from his actions. In fact, the defense argued that the minivan Teresa was photographing that day was Barb Janda’s, and Steven left Barb’s name and number. Plus, Teresa had been to the Avery residence 5 times in the past few months. I don’t think she would have been “tricked” into showing up at an address on the Avery property just because she was given a different name and phone number. She knew the address and knew exactly where she was headed.

  • Avery called Teresa’s phone three times that afternoon–and two of those times he utilized the *67 feature to conceal his identity. People Magazine reports Kratz claimed Steven called once at 2:24 p.m. and again at 2:35 p.m., using *67 both times, so Teresa would not be able to see who was calling her. He also called again at 4:35 p.m. This time, he did not use *67 and the state claims that’s because he already knew she was dead, so he didn’t need to conceal his identity, and he was trying to establish an alibi by calling at that point (maybe to later claim she never showed up and he was calling to see what the hold up is).

Ok, let’s break this down a bit. We know Steven is expecting Teresa to arrive around 2:00, based on the message she left for Barb Janda in the morning. Those first two calls to Teresa’s phone could have been Steven wondering if she was going to show up. Bobby Dassey stated in his testimony that he saw Teresa arrive a little after 2:30 to photograph the minivan, and he left the residence shortly after that (around 2:45) and stated he saw Teresa walking toward Steven’s trailer at that time. But the bus driver in the documentary, Lisa Buchner, stated she saw Teresa on the property taking photos between 3:30 and 3:40. And another witness, John Leurquin, a man filling up a propane tank near the Avery property, stated he saw Teresa’s vehicle leaving the area, however he did not see who was driving. He claims he usually fills up his tank between 3:30 and 4:00 each day. Take all that for what it’s worth. I don’t know if Steven Avery has ever explained why he called Teresa’s phone at 4:35 p.m. that day.

  • Steven’s DNA was also found under the hood of Teresa’s RAV4, and it did not come from blood. Kratz claims non-blood DNA belonging to Steven was found under the hood of the car and the battery had been disconnected. This, he claims, proves police didn’t plant it, since the sample did not contain any blood, but was comprised of something else, such as skin cells or sweat.

Ok, that’s all fine and dandy, but before you make up your mind about this piece of evidence, give this post a read. I can’t understand why you have the SUV in police possession at the state crime lab and you only think to test the door handles and underneath the hood for DNA five months after you recover it? Sorry, but that doesn’t add up to me. They also claim the only reason they tested it was because of what Brendan Dassey admitted in one of his “confessions,” but if you read the transcript, you’ll see investigators specifically asked him about what Steven did under the hood of the car.

  • Steven Avery had purchased handcuffs and leg irons three weeks before Teresa went missing. The state claims Brendan Dassey admitted these items were used to restrain Teresa in Steven’s trailer.

Steven openly admitted in a Milwaukee Magazine article he did purchase these items, but he bought them to use with Jodi. And, unfortunately for the state, none of Teresa’s DNA was found on the leg irons or handcuffs, which seems very hard to believe if she really was shackled to Steven’s bed. Oh, and let’s take a look at what those leg irons and handcuffs looked like. Wow. Really?

handcuffs

  • Brendan Dassey’s jeans from Oct. 31 were stained with bleach and he told investigators it was from helping Steven clean his garage floor with bleach and paint thinner.

This was included in the trial, and out of all the missing pieces of evidence above, I think it’s one of the most important. Not only did Brendan tell his mother and the investigators that he helped clean Steven’s garage with bleach that day, but Steven also told Jodi in one of their phone calls that evening that Brendan was helping him clean the garage. Investigators recovered the bleach-stained jeans from Brendan’s house, but no DNA evidence linking him to Teresa was ever found. And of course, we all know from watching the documentary that none of her blood was found in the garage–even after they dug up the cement floor to look for blood that might have seeped into the cracks. The only thing in the garage linking to Teresa was the single bullet fragment located underneath an air compressor months after her murder that later tested positive for her DNA. 

That’s all I can dig up on the missing evidence from the documentary. Do you think it was 80-90% of the evidence, as Kratz stated earlier? I certainly don’t. And, as I mentioned in yesterday’s post, I don’t think it’s enough to convince me of Steven’s guilt–but I don’t necessarily believe he is 100% innocent either. All I’m saying is we still don’t know what happened there that day and, to be honest, I’m not sure any of us will ever know. What I do know is that juries are only instructed to find a person guilty if the state has proven their case beyond reasonable doubt, and I don’t think that happened. I believe the defense poked many holes in the state’s theory and the jury got it wrong. That doesn’t mean I think he is innocent. It just means I think he should have been found not-guilty. There is a big difference. I don’t think he should be pardoned or exonerated, but I do think he deserves a fair trial. What do you think after reading all the evidence? Does this change your mind about the documentary?

 

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126 thoughts on “What did Netflix’s “Making a Murderer” leave out?

  1. Thanks for this!

    The garage floor search did also come up with Steven’s DNA, so if the claim that bleach and paint thinner was used to clean up Teresa’s blood/DNA, then why did it not also clean up Steven’s? There’s not a bleach out there that will erase one person’s DNA and not another’s, is there?

    I do think that when we look at the phone records, the timeline of about 2:40 is when she reached the Avery property. I don’t know how to explain the bus driver and the guy who saw the vehicle leave at 3:30 – 4:00, but she told Auto Trader she was about 10 minutes away from the Avery property at 2:27. Unless she was just lying, it leads me to believe that she was there about 10 minutes after that phone call.

    How on earth is Kratz able to insert hearsay without bringing in the people who supposedly said Steven told him those things in prison?

    • All good points, Rose! I don’t know how to explain the last phone call either, but it could be something as simple as him calling her to let her know she left something there. I wish I knew more about his side of the story for that piece of evidence.

      • The 4:35 phone call could have been something as simple as a follow to the services she had just provided and nothing more. Maybe he just had a question or two about when would the Auto Trader listing be listed.

      • I just read about the last phone, redditt has the transcripts of the trial and the interviews conducted, Avery said he called her that last time because he had something else to sell and wanted her to photogragh that as well

    • Good point.
      Arrive: 2.30ish
      Maybe she does walk to Steve’s trailer, but thinks better of it and goes back.
      Maybe chats w/ someone else – Barb? Bobby? Someone who isn’t talking with a diff motive not to?
      Takes photos for awhile. Maybe sits in her car looking them over. Goes to take some more when the bus arrives.
      Leaves when the fuel guy says.

      People aren’t looking at this as if actions take time. They’re thinking in snapshots rather than flow.

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  3. Thanks for breaking it down. On the bullet fragment with the DNA supposedly on it wasn’t that contaminated? Didn’t the State’s DNA expert admit she was teaching colleagues at the time. When the results came back it showed her own DNA? Then they decided to go ahead and use it or am I confused? As my memory serves me the bullet fragment with the DNA should have been ruled “inconclusive” but the DNA technician stated she had the option of using it as “conclusive” if she wanted to and did. Am I confused? Thanks

    • Yes, that’s correct. It was used in court, even though the lab technician’s DNA was found on the bullet as well. In my mind, that should have been deemed inconclusive. I think the defense did a good job at alerting the jury to that, but it should never have been used in the first place.

      • This was a really great read. People are taking this “left out evidence” and really running with it, acting like it’s some kind of smoking gun. Oohhh that silly Ken Kratz. It really adds nothing. Thank you for breaking it down so clearly, I had the same thought when I read about this new info.

      • Really good article! Don’t forget that it was found a note to the woman saying something like “put her blood in the garage or trailer”

          • I think she means the notes taken by the DNA crime lab tester Sherry Culhane who wrote down Fassbender’s comment to “put her in the garage”. I rewatched the entire series last Saterday and saw the date on the note. Check yourself, but I think it was in November, which was before they found the magic bullet.

          • agent (interrogator of Brendan amongst other thing) Fassbender wrote on the request for bullet forensics that he wanted Teresa (i.e. her DNA) placed “in the garage” – so an attempt to get the forensic lady to steer the results, she says that despite this she was totally unbiased and that its just coincidental that they stuffed the protocol on the test, that it was the first invalid test allowed to be presented and that she did the test in such a way that removed all traces of anything organic from that bullet.

    • That bullet with dna doesn’t mean steve did it there are alot of people living there bobby Scott Charles chuck Allen the parents that garage was community property used by all the averys

  4. They spent five days cleaning the scene and left the car key on the floor??? They spent five days cleaning the scene and his blood is right next to the steering wheel??? It doesn’t even close to add up.

    • I agree. There are so many things that don’t add up in this case. Steven’s DNA was found in the Rav 4, but no fingerprints. I guess if he had gloves on his DNA could have been in the gloves, but then how did the blood get through the gloves? Also his DNA on the key, what about fingerprints on the key? I don’t recall ANY fingerprint evidence on anything.

  5. The only thing I think is crazy is that, if she were killed October 31st, since that is when she was raped, tortured, neck sliced with knife, shot and burned, how in the heck did he have time to clean the garage with bleach, talk on the phone with Jodi twice, acting completely normal and Brenden goes back home as nothing happened. I would say that this is a quick timing. Especially since they supposedly watched TV after the rape, torture ordeal. Doesn’t make a bit of sense.

    • Totally agree! Plus, Steven was around for both of Jodi’s phone calls that evening, not out cleaning blood in the garage or moving her car to the farthest part of the lot.

    • I’d like to see a re-enactment of the state’s timeline to show it’s impossible. Maybe the new lawyers will attempt it.

    • Barb (who changes her mind about who is to blame about 50 times) should have known the truth if Brendan had been involved at all because of his movements, his clothing etc, its a joke that Avery with his borderline intellectual disability is a supposed forensics genius with aptitude beyond that of fictional dexter morgan but also that Brendan who actually was in special education and is recognised as intellectually disabled supposedly covered his tracks in the physical/forensic sense but totally implicated himself verbally just so he could get back to school in time for 6th period

  6. I find your analysis of the “excluded evidence” incredibly intriguing. My only inquiry is why you think he isn’t 100% innocent. I watched the docu-series also, and my opinion is that he had nothing to do with the death of Teresa Halbach, but was, unfortunately, a threat to the county and the reputation of their employees.

    • I just haven’t seen any evidence that definitely points to someone else–have you? I can’t rule it out because of that. However, I do think it’s unlikely he is the killer. I’m just not 100% sure he is innocent.

      • I agree with you that its difficult to definitively say he is innocent. The fact is that the police work if not suspect, was shoddy. There were many other leads they just didn’t investigate. The other 4 men living on the property. Steven’s brothers Chuck and Earl…both of whom had histories of abuse of women. I read that when the police came to question Earl, they found him hiding under some clothes in a closet. Scott, the brother in law and Bobby Dassey, Brendan’s brother…. only had alibis for each other and their timelines seem to be out of synch with the bus driver and seemed too quick to point a finger at Steven. Finally, the ex boyfriend who hacked her phone was never asked for an alibi and was questioned with the roommate.

        • there are so many loose ends that weren’t investigated and at the same time, Avery didn’t (presuming he did it) leave many loose ends for someone at ~70 IQ .
          Halbachs ex ‘casually’ ‘dated’ Teresa for FIVE years i.e. most of their adult lives and in his college magazine his comedy statement under his face is “women are evil” – considering she was 25 when she died,stopped dating him some time prior etc we can assume lots of his ideas about female spouses are derived from Teresa who coincidentally did a video at age 23 all about a scenario in which she would die, reflecting on how happy her life has been. her adult life was still beginning, she was not at all likely to die – was this video some kind of joke or fantasy thing recorded when she was “dating” ?

          its all supposedly so casual yet the Ex visited Teresa the day before she set out to do the photo shoots and he was able to get into her phone records and voicemail online using her family members birthdates ? I don’t remember the birthdates for my extended family 8 years into being married!

          he and halbachs youngest brother were prompting each other when interviewed during the search, the brother (brad was it?) cut off the Ex when the ex blurted about finding evidence for the police and the ex quickly refined his words to make it sound like an *in theory* kind of statement rather than an admission.

          Pam Sturn who found the car was given a direct phone line connection to Sheriff Pagel of Calumet (remember the guy who briskly walked out of a press conference when the journos twigged that nobody knew where Avery was in custody and thus his lawyers didnt thus he was being denied legal counsel?) and was also given a camera, found the car within twenty minutes and is potentially heard in the background of Andy Coulburns call in of the license plate two days before the car was supposedly found where he preempts the dispatcher and tells THEM the year and model of Teresas car! the plates werent found with the car!
          if the recording is turned up loud you hear someone who sounds a lot like Sturn in the background saying that ‘the car is here!’

          the court proceedings as well as Teresas ex and teresas brother fail to mention that Pam Sturn is a private investigator and make out that she is just a distant family connection for the Halbachs

      • i say look into bobby whereabouts that whole day,
        also he said Steve asked him(bobby) and mike(bobby friend) about helping with getting rid of the body
        whose mike

        • I think there is a lot of evidence we didn’t see or hear. If the cops did plant evidence, they could have easily hidden or suppressed other evidence that didn’t point to Steven. Remember they were hell bent that he was guilty from the very beginning. Just as they were with his first conviction.

  7. Can someone please answer me this: were the human bone remains definitively Teresa’s? I don’t recall this ever being mentioned and I watched the series twice. Also, finding Steven’s DNA under the hood of her car doesn’t prove anything, she WAS there. She could have been having car issues and he looked under the hood to help her.

  8. 80-90% of the evidence was left out, what a joke! It just proves that if the police want someone to take the fall they will go to any length to make it stick! Most of the jury found Steven guilty before the trial, just like the cops found him guilty before they did an investigation! How convenient that all the evidence (planted) found was by the police in the county that had a conflict of interest and should of stayed out of it! They got what they wanted!

    • I believe Kratz mentions (or his assistant) during the trial that 940 objects were confiscated from the Avery property. funnily enough, despite being able to flaunt this number of objects they have only one with Teresas DNA on it, the bullet found after how many searches in an otherwise DNA free zone ?
      Lenk is a real lucky charm huh! if you rub that bald head incriminating evidence about that bloke who was suing him days prior will appear at the avery property! wow!

  9. One thing that is intriguing to me is why the defense (to my knowledge) didn’t try to move the trial outside the area, given Steven’s previous conviction that was based on circumstantial evidence.

    This even apart from the fact that jury selection was so difficult.

    My thinking is factoring in the excused juror’s comments certainly, but it seems obvious that a jury in another area of the state would have been more likely to be impartial. Not to mention the judge. If the jury has rendered a different verdict, I don’t think he planned on telling Steven that he was the best kind of innocent person (the opposite of what he said at sentencing).

    That said, perhaps with the defense strategy taken (framing), they thought it worked in their favor to have as much knowledge of the prior case that was overturned in the jury pool and in the courtroom.

    • I’ll look into this more to confirm, but I am SURE the defense did try to move the trial to another county. It’s one of the first things defense lawyers do when there is a highly publicized case.

    • In an interview (forget which one) Dean Strange said they didn’t try and move the trial outside of the county because the press conference detailing Brendan’s “confession” had aired, tainting the jury pool statewide. The defenses decided to try the case locally, where the community at least had a better understanding of the situation regarding Steven’s past conviction, exoneration and pending lawsuit.

    • The judge in Dasseys case denied very legit requests from the defence (like Brendan asking for new counsel) and the same happened with the judge in Avery’s case and each guy got the same judge at various attempts at appeal too. should have been another judge so there is less resistance to potentially compromising ones own record of convictions

  10. I think the state made up as much as they could to cover up that 2 sheriffs killed a girl to set up Steve Avery. The amount he was asking for in the lawsuit might have jeopardized their department. The evidence points more that way to me.

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  12. I don’t understand why no one is talking about the other locations the bones were found. There were fragments at the quarry and in the Janda barrel, in addition to Stevens burn pit. Perhaps someone (not necessarily the police, but another family member or friend who knew police would be looking hard at Steven) burned her body at the quarry and used the barrel to transport the bones to Steven’s pit. Seems incredible strange to have the bones spread out to those other sites and I haven’t heard an explanation for it. Am I missing something?

    • Exactly. They speculate that the remains were scattered to cause confusion. It that were the case, why were the majority of the remains found in the burn pit. What makes way more sense is that she was burned at the quarry, and in the attempt to move the remains to the burn pit, some were missed, and some were stuck in the barrel, which is far more likely than only taking a small portion of the remains and putting them in the barrel and the quarry.

      Another conclusion that I find ludicrous is the prosecution claims that the magazine and bill of sale in the house proves she was in the house. That only proves he had a magazine and that she did take pictures of the van, which was never denied.

      He was absolutely framed, and I believe it was the cops who actually killed her. The specter of losing a $36 million lawsuit will make people do all kinds of things that they may normally not do. And we all know to what lengths cops will go to cover their own asses.

      • that Sheriff who just let it roll off his tongue that it would have been easier to *pause* eliminate (oops! nearly said kill, thats too emotive!) Avery than to frame him. i.e. they might have selected something that looks more improbable to the public (police framings are assumed as total nonsense conspiracy 90% of the time) but actually isn’t. it would be far more suspect if during the depositions where all these police who were being shown to have it in for Avery and shown to want to get convictions no matter how suddenly had the person suing them wind up with a bullet in their head.

  13. Did anyone else catch the comment by one of Teresa’s brothers – while she was still missing – where he said that the family was “grieving”, and in the next sentence talks about trying to find her. Might have been Episode 2 or 3. The statement was made very quickly after Teresa’s disappearance, but that word is almost never used unless and until someone is talking about a known death. Any thoughts?

    • it was ONE day after she was officially reported missing, perhaps the first thing he actually said on TV and yes, he said that he wanted to find out what *happened* to her as soon as possible so they can ‘move on with the grieving process’ then after an awkward pause ‘hopefully with Teresa still in our lives’

  14. This case is so similar to the Amanda Knox case. Severely lacking in any real evidence, the prosecution builds this horrific, diabolical story regarding what happened at the scene of the murder of Meredith Kercher and has to fabricate and mislead jurors in order to attempt to prove their case against Amanda Knox (that they were never able to place at the scene). The prosecutor in the Amanda Knox case was obsessed with satanic rituals, Masonic occult practices, and sex cults. Prior to the Knox trial, he was already charged with corruption in another case. Anyway, Kratz reminded me of a more subdued American version of this prosecutor, so backwards and repressed and then the ethics issue later with the sexting. Anyway, I could go on and on….both cases are very sad to me. The power that these obviously very screwed up people to determine scapegoats for crimes and then be able to destroy their lives, although Knox is out so she’s fared better than Dassey and Avery.

  15. I think the ex boyfriend and roommate should be looked into more. Others around her should be looked at as well. Avery and Dassey had zero motive to do this. I think they were just simple people easily made to be a scapegoat. I would really like a to see a new judge and new jurors (especially not connected to either side). Somethis is very wrong here. I especially don’t like how detectives are more interested in prosecuting “a persons or persons” and not interested in if the truth was told. Being interested in a pressured confession from a mentally challenged youth is bad police work in my opinion and Kratz should have even seen this for what it was. Brendan should have said Santas elves helped, then they would have had a trial like Miracle on 34th street (christmas movie). This is just as amazing to me that an investigation isn’t done by the FBI or something so we can get an independent viewpoint.

  16. It’s important to note that the so-called handcuffs and leg irons are nothing more than fuzzy fluffy PINK sex toys that are easily purchased in a shop and easily breakable. They are certainly not the Amistad shackles and chains ken kratz would like us to believe. Kratz continues his smear campaign in order to try to hide his gross misconduct. He was after all popping pills due to the high stress of such a high profile case.

  17. I’d like to know why The Ex boyfriend, The Brother, and The Roommate were not questioned and considered “persons of interest”, ever. Instead, they were deputized coordinators of “the search”. What did The Brother mean when he discussed grieving Teresa before she was found? Is grieving not something one does AFTER a loss? And HOPING something one does until death is confirmed???
    I’d focus my investigation on these boys.

    • I agree! I thought it a bit strange that The Brother seems to do all of the talking for The Halbach Family. Plus in that ‘creepy’ video of T.H. that is apparently a school project; she says she loves her sisters, then goes on to say she loves her entire family. I’m not sure if The Brother is involved or not, I think it’s more a Family looking for the guilty person or persons.

      • yes,at age 23 she is talking about her life (which should be just beginning, her adult life) and about how the video is for if she dies. her ex was most like doing that casual dating as he described their FIVE year relationship at this time – is it possible he got her to do this video as part of a fetish or fantasy ? I’ve never heard of a young person doing this kind of thing except in cases where they expected to be killed or were actually about to go commit a school shooting.

    • Agreed! Those dudes gave me super creepy vibes since I first saw them, specially the brother, he just always acted so weird. I get that it was his sister, but anyone who saw the tapes of the cops questioning Brendan could tell it wasn’t a confession at all and the brother kept repeating how guilty Brendan was, that was just so off to me.
      And the whole password thing with the phone, that was shady stuff. Also noted that in Theresa’s “goodbye” video she refers only to her sisters.

  18. I’m speaking as a police officer and even I felt there were several questionable practices by the state and the police, at best. I was very uncomfortable with the home county being involved in the evidence search, when it was specifically said that only Calumet County was supposed to search. Lt. Lenk and Sgt. Culbrun creep me out as well. Perhaps I’m off base and they are 100% honest cops, but they come off smug, cocky and a little dirty. If we are putting forth a standard of “reasonable doubt”, then the defense certainly appeared to do that, based on what we saw and what we can find on the Internet as reported and unreported evidence. The State failed to prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

    • I’m not an officer but have been in two professions of a similar nature, one involving offenders of precisely the IQ range Avery and Dassey are in, would you share my view that people in these jobs actually should take questions about their integrity as a part of the job and answer without having to state how insulted they are by the question ? I have always considered it to be the case that people in positions of authority have the most responsibility to assure the public of their honour by answering any query about how they conducted an investigation or other procedure. Whining and feigning outrage are the outlets of the incompetent and corrupt, Kratz did nothing but whine (after initial denial) when he was exposed as someone who sexually harasses women who are his clients and who are victims of psychologically damaging abuse (i.e. very vulnerable) .
      Kratz told Maxim that the inclusion of his harassment scandal shows the documentary was slanted smear but actually, he had opportunity to paint Dassey and Avery as he wished to even before their trial started and considering Kratz was working with and for a particular police force that had implicated/framed Avery once before his ethics are EXTREMELY relevant to what direction the case went in.
      look at Kachinsky and Kelly who were employed to help Brendan Dassey, they actually worked to assist the prosecution – do we expect they did this with no pressure or no monetary incentive from a police force standing to lose 36 million for how they treated Avery in the past ? Kratz flaunts his wage (to the women he harassed) flaunts his married status as just being attractively “risky” for potential girlfriends to be turned on by and is now trying to release a book exploiting Avery and Dassey, I haven’t seen evidence that Kratz would refuse money or be faithful to his job description and protocols when he seems willing to compromise everything else and exploit everything he should be taking as a blessing.

  19. I don’t know what to believe anymore. I don’t think the police killed that woman but I think they certainly corrupted the evidence. The “ex-boyfriend” seems quite odd to me. Who’s ex is still involved in their girlfriends life to such an extent that he can guess a cell number and then take it upon himself to delete messages. Very very odd.

    • and who calls a 5 year relationship ‘dating’ – at his age she would have been his main GF and main reference point for women and in his college magazine the quote he chose to include is that women are ‘evil’ and his 23 year old girlfriend/future ex GF records a video about the possibility of her dying but smiles right through it, was it filmed at the request of someone with a fantasy about her dying ? why on earth does someone that young film this, these are usually the property of people going to commit suicide, go on a shooting spree or in a job/office that risks them being assassinated

  20. They should test the blood in the tube for EDTA too.
    Also, this more for The boy, they kept talking about rape, but how can they talk about rape from bones? No body secretions, nothing that proves it

    • do you mean they should test the tube because it would be a control test where we know there IS EDTA present and it could reveal the failure rate of the rapidly devised test ? if so, I agree

      • They did test the blood vial for EDTA. The final FBI report lists it in the trial exhibit 435 as present in the vial blood.

    • They also never mention any testing that confirms those were in fact her bones, did they? I find it strange that they wouldn’t try to confirm the victims identity.

      • Hi Ana
        Although it may not have been in the documentary, the transcripts show that local information about identity of the bones was inconclusive. There was at least one bone with tissue attached, not just the bone itself. The state lab sent it to the FBI to test and they conclusively identified it as Teresa.

        However, as someone pointed out elsewhere, the comparison was using Teresa’s **mother**. That seems odd, since there should have been amble DNA material from her house — hair, toothbrush, make-up — that could have and should have been used. What they could have meant though, is that since TH wasn’t available herself, they had to use her closest relative for the comparison because they were certain of the mother as source, being a living person.

        Hope that helps. It was Teresa’s bones in the burn pit.

  21. Also that ex boyfriend looked very suspicious to me. He would look to the ground too much. Even before they said that he was the exbf, in the interview to the people of the search team I could tell he seemed to be hiding something.

    • And the brother, the ex and the brother seemed like buddies. We didn’t get much air time for the ex, but I found the brother acted in a strange way and said weird things, something about him was just off to me, he had a strange smirk in many of the parts where he was giving statements.

  22. One thing on the DNA on the hood latch, they never actually proved it wasn’t from blood: https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/406qfo/it_was_not_proven_that_the_dna_on_the_hood_latch/

    Because it was such a small sample, they didn’t do a presumptive test indicating it was blood, and apparently the sample was discolored. Given how small it was and that the investigator testified he didn’t change gloves between inspecting the inside of Teresas car and popping the hood, it seems like it very well could have been from blood transferred on the investigators gloves

  23. A guy who has been in the wrecking yard biz his whole life…..who bleached the floor in his garage….is not going to leave the car intact on his own property with the tags still on…..job one would have been to cut it into short iron with a cutting torch. My only real question after watching was whether the judge was crooked also…..

      • the judge allowed just a couple of tiny objections etc from the defence case , probably to avoid appearance of bias. e.g. that cop from Calumet who said something like ‘yeah its possible they had a chance to plant it but its also possible that aliens did it’ – the judge allowed that to be struck from the record. big deal , it was a massive and stupid joke that Kratz had set up with ‘in the sense that anything is possible?’

        he , just like Dasseys judge, should have disallowed a bundle of stuff

  24. Pingback: Making A Murderer - Page 2 - REVscene Automotive Forum

  25. You did a good job here finding evidence not mentioned in the documentary but let’s be clear here you have no idea if any of what you mentioned is even included in the 80-90% he mentioned. It’s not like you interviewed him and he let you look at the evidence. This is simply the result of an Internet search.

    • I never claimed to interview him. I compiled this listing of missing “evidence” from multiple sources–Kratz is frantically emailing news sources with this information claiming it is the damning evidence the filmmakers left out. My point is yes, evidence was left out of the documentary but no, it isn’t 80-90% of the evidence and no, it isn’t as damning as he claims. Jerry Buting seems to agree as well.

    • Kratz is free to name anything compelling, he tried it in the trial,speaking of how 940 physical items were removed from the Avery property – so what, the only one from the house or garage with Halbach’s DNA was the bullet and that result was from an invalid test that conveniently rendered the bullet sterile and unable to have further testing done on it.
      if anything is relevant all Kratz needs to do is name it and people make up their minds

      • Exactly, they could have brought the whole yard, if nothing was found on it what good would that do? Also given the way in which most “evidence” was collected should it even be considered admissible evidence at all?

    • I have to respond regarding the issue of the hole in the blood vial, aka vacutainer. The hole is in no way indicative of tampering. In fact every used vacutainer (one that has been filled with blood) will have a hole in it just like the one seen in the one containing Steven Avery’s blood. The hole is made when the blood is drawn. Something called a needle holder is inserted into the vacutainer and the blood goes in through that. The needle holder leaves a small hole in the rubber stopper on top. This is likely how the hole in the Avery vial was made.
      Although the hole is not evidence of tampering (I don’t know why it was presented that way) it of course doesn’t mean that the vial wasn’t tampered with. It’s of course possible that someone could have withdrawn blood using a syringe inserted into the already existing hole. But, as mentioned, the existence of a hole is not at all as significant as the documentary made it out to be.

      • I assume something about the hole was visibly different, these were seasoned lawyers with some knowledge of forensics, they stated that it was characteristic of a hypodermic needle. you make a good point, I hope we find out more, maybe Jerome Buting can comment on it.

  26. I think there is something not normal, why the blood was not tested by chromatography technology it was avilable since 1997 for dried stained blood! Why can not be used now! Tge devices have grater limit of detection which could detect nono traces !
    Why he sit up fire!
    I dont know if ge is guilty or not but I agree he desrive fair trail

  27. The simple truth whether u believe he’s guilty or innocent he did not get a fair trial and the judge should be held accountable for not allowing them to bring in possible suspects allowing relative of the cops and court to sit on the jury allowing info in to pregudice the jury like the bullet with no way to prove it was fired by Steven and allowing all the other evidence collected by manitowoc into trial since it was bias we r not talking any cops we r talking the exact cops named in the suit

    • I agree, people are focusing on whether Steven did it or not and I don’t think the question here is about that. The question here is we can not tell who did it, or how it was done, because the police acted in an unfair way and didn’t follow the rules. And after that there was more shady stuff going on leading to an unfair trial, where there was lots and lots of bias and conflicts of interest.
      There needs to be a review of everything by an impartial party, since the “evidence” collection to the end of the trial. But now that 8 years have passed it will be harder to determine what really happened.

  28. Great article. I find it highly unlikely that Steven would be stupid enough to risk (1) a potential $36 million pay day (especially given that he and his family have lived in poverty their whole lives; and (2) redemption against the State who previously took so much away from him and his family.

    One thing that confuses me is and I’m wondering whether was covered was – if Steven supposed burned Theresa’s corpse in the bonfire, wouldn’t anyone in the vicinity have smelled something strange?

    My theory was that he was framed. I think someone close to Theresa knew she was going to the Avery yard (e.g. we know that several people had access to her phone’s voicemails) and decided that would be a good place to kill her since the community already distrust the Avery’s, especially Steven. I think whoever it was played on that, thinking that they could get away with it since they’d be given the police a great opportunity to get out of the lawsuit they were surely going to lose. I think Colborn found the car and body nearby, phoned Lenk, and they hatched the plan to quickly move the car into the yard, burn the body, move the bones, plant the key and blood, and frame Steven.

  29. Thanks Jennifer for your time gathering the additional evidence information!

    This case is so disturbing to me and I cannot stop thinking about it.

    First, I can’t begin to imagine that either Steve or Brendon had the capacity to commit the crimes as described let alone clean up the crime scene afterwards without any DNA traces.

    Impossible!

    The location of the houses of all the family members. Wouldn’t someone have heard a gunshot on the property?

    Brendon’s brothers testimony…what we saw was so weird…and he was heading out on a hunting trip? So he was armed?

    The school bus driver…she dropped off Brendon everyday after school surely she would know what time her stops are made.

    Steven’s bedroom…did any one see a bed frame that could support shackles of any kind? It looked like a mattress on a box spring. An old mattress like the one we saw would surely have stains from being cleaned…bleach especially. Anyone who has ever tried to cleaned a mattress knows what I mean. And the bedroom had paneling didn’t it? How could you clean inside the panels every trace or the carpet which was not torn up. Blood stains and bleach can be detected with lights can’t they? Then removing the body from the house…blood, hair, skin along the exit path? And this was done at dusk?

    Now the garage…there must of been at least a few thousand items in there. Unless they covered the entire garage with multi-layers of plastic how could blood from a fatal gunshot wound not be found? There is absolutely no way they could of cleaned that place…it would of taken hours and hours if not days to hunt down every tiny drop of blood and hair, bone and flesh. Gunpowder leaves residue as well, but nothing found.

    The auto trader info inside his place…really! Why would that be suspicious? She was there conducting business you would expect her to leave info.

    Fellow employees I believe said something about
    her receiving phone calls from someone who wouldn’t leave her alone? Who was calling her?
    Her ex? Her brother? Something including his comments about grieving just seem quite strange.

    Her vehicle…her blood in the back?

    One other thing…there was video from news helicopters. I read that someone didn’t see the vehicle in the early footage.

    • I noticed that too, those two whose only alibi was to go hunting. One of them takes the day off to be with his mother and then comes home and goes hunting… it is awkward.
      If I was the one investigating those two would have looked suspicious to me, in fact the only ones more suspicious would be the brother-ex-roomate trio. And I also found it strange that no one looked into the repeated calls thing and the missing voice mails…

  30. Great article! These are my thoughts exactly. There is no way to know for sure if Steven is guilty or not, but one thing we do know for sure and that is that there are too many questions left unanswered to determine his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

  31. What I’d like to know….we know her camera was found in the burn barrel with other burnt items, but I havent heard or read anywhere if there were any test done on it to see if any photos could be processed off of it, has anyone?

    • No idea about the camera itself. Good question. There was also a memory card found in the back of the RAV. It’s listed in the evidence exhibits:
      Exhibit 496: Verbatim flash memory card with name Teresa on it.

      But what I’ve seen in the transcripts does NOT say they actually looked at the contents. I’ve tweeted that question to his new lawyers and J Buting, hoping they will press to have it examined. If there are photos from that day’s shoot, the time stamps on the photos would prove the order of her visits that day, which is still in question. The Zipperer wife says TH came to them at 3pm, which would be AFTER she was at Avery’s.

  32. So you just dismiss it all? Come on. So this is a bigger conspiracy than the OJ trial now.

    All the blood and non-blood DNA was planted or isn’t real?

    How did these people plant this stuff? On the spur of the moment, somehow knowing the girl was going to be killed?

    you left out the stuff about the bones being intertwined with the tires, meaning there’s no doubt she was burned there in Avery’s fire pit.

    There’s a few other things but my question is, these police risked their lives to set up Avery why? Because of his 36 million dollar case? Which doesn’t affect these cops in any way. They’re not paying anything. Why would they care if he gets 36 mil? Makes zero sense.

  33. @ JB I think you need to watch the documentary again. Obviously you don’t remember the sheriffs department seized the SA property for 7 or 8 days.

  34. So your contention is these dastardly police used those 7 or 8 days to plant evidence. A couple tiny pieces of blood evidence and one non-blood DNA under the hood of the car – and Halbach’s DNA on the bullet fragment (how they did that one is anotehr amazing feat). Yet if they had the property for over a week, why not splash the DNA evidence everywhere? Why one little spot of non-DNA blood under the hood? why not all over her car? Why not splash Halbach’s DNA all over the garage? They’re planting evidence to set up this guy (because you know, they don’t want the county to pay the 36 mil that makes no difference to them) and risk their lives to set him up yet they plant every little DNA when they could have splashed it everywhere making it clear who the killer was.

    Now I’ve asked this to a few supporters already and all I’m met with is childish insults. I’d love to hear one actual excuse from someone over the age of 16.

    • They most likely did not have enough of her blood to splash it around…..also, remember that the Manitowoc Sheriff’s deputies were not allowed there, so they had very limited time and access once the car was ” found”. Just my opinion : )

  35. Yes, having read ALL the trial transcripts and over 1,100 pages of Calumet County reports, along with numerous other evidentiary documents, I am shocked and appalled at the amount of very important details that were left out of the documentary. I mean, over 10 hours of film and they weave this intricate tale of cops “planting” evidence. In reality, even without the key and the supposed blood planting, the prosecution had a very solid case against Steven Avery….Brendan Dassey? Not so much. There is nothing that convinces me he was a party to this horrendous act, most notably, the lack of scientific evidence. His confessions should never have been admitted as they were all clearly coerced.

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